Mr. DEMPSEY.-With respect to shipping plums to England, I think it will be a long day before it pays. I have seen plums in England, which we cannot hope to equal, sold at a shilling a bushel. The plum is a fruit which I never cared much for myself, but I must confess that I liked the plum I saw in England. But their apples and pears will not compare for a moment with ours, either in flavor or color. Their best apples and pears are grown on walls, but it does not pay commercially to grow them in this way. Mr. Allan and I had some pears of the Duchess d' Angoulême variety, which were grown on a wall, and we did not care to eat them. The climate of England is not adapted to the growth of pears or apples. Some experts there admitted that cider made from our apples could bear twenty per cent. more water and yet be better than theirs.

WOOD ASHES AS A FERTILISER.

The next question was: Does it pay the fruit grower to make his own commercial fertiliser, providing he can buy wood ashes at ten cents a bushel, delivered? What other fertiliser should be mixed with wood ashes to make a complete fertiliser? Are wood ashes suitable to all kinds of soil?

Prof. C. C. JAMES, of the Ontario Agricultural College, Guelph, in reply, said: The question of the relationship of ashes to the orchard must be considered from the point of view of what the orchard requires. There are three demands made upon the soil; first, for the wood; second, for the leaves; and third, for the fruit. The demand made on the soil for the wood, though greatest perhaps in the younger days of the tree, never ceases. Now, hard-wood ashes, such as are available, have been obtained simply by the burning of wood quite similar in composition to the wood of our fruit trees, so that if you return to the soil those ashes, you are returning just what the trees require and in about the proper proportions; so that, for the growth of wood, the application of hard wood ashes is the most practical and the most economical. In regard to the leaves, they vary greatly during the season. At the time the leaves fall, their most valuable constituents return to the sap; yet there still remains in the skeleton leaf a considerable quantity of constituents which are valuable. Whether these be lost to the orchard or not, depends on its location and its protection from winds; those orchards best protected will suffer the least, while those less protected will suffer most in the long run. In the case of fruit there is of course no return to the soil; that is a loss which is certainly irremediable. I find that material along this line is widely scattered and somewhat difficult to obtain. Nevertheless, I have been able to obtain and summarise the constituents removed from the orchard in the fruits of apples, pears, plums, peaches, grapes and berries. I may say that bardwood ashes are being shipped in large quantities from Ontario, not only to fruit growers in the Northern States, but to the orange plantations of Florida; and, while the fruit growers of this country have been neglecting this great source of profit, the fruit growers of the United States have been paying as much as thirty-five cents a bushel for Canadian ashes by the carload. If American fruit growers have been finding it profitable to purchase our ashes at that rate, I think the question is settled that it will pay you to retain them here if you can get them as low as ten cents a bushel. In the chart which I have prepared I have first put down the percentages of the constituents removed by the fruit per hundred pounds. Then in a second table I have set down an average crop of these various fruits to show the proportion of constituents removed from the soil. For instance, taking a crop of apples at fifteen thousand pounds, there is drawn from the soil for it about twelve pounds of nitrogen, one and one-half pounds of phosphoric acid, nineteen and one-half pounds of potash, and four and one-third pounds of lime. If you analyse the various fruits, you will find in the ash from 50 to 75 per cent. of potash, which certainly proves that potash is the principal ingredient taken from the soil by your various fruit crops. Second in importance is lime; but it is not so important from a commercial point of view, for the reason that nearly all our soils are well supplied with lime. Besides every phosphate contains a large quantity of lime, whether superphosphates, or ashes, or bones, so that when applying either of these you will be applying lime at the same time. Next comes phosphoric acid, and lastly, nitrogen. The question, then, resolves itself simply into this, how will wood ashes meet these four or five demands which

are created by the removal of the fruit from the soil? In my chart I have shown the constituents of hardwood ashes. In the first place they contain from 6 to 8 per cent. of potash. If you take a bushel of hard wood ashes weighing 48 or 50 pounds, every bushel you put on your orchard will contain at least 3 pounds of potash. That will be worth 4 or 5 cents a pound at least, so that your bushel of ashes contains potash which is worth at least 12 or 13 cents, probably a little more in some cases. A fair average would be 7 per cent. of potash. Next, phosphoric acid amounts to about 2 per cent., which in 50 pounds of ashes will give about 1 pound of phosphoric acid, worth from 2 to 5 cents; a fair valuation would probably be 4 cents. If we add this to our valuation of 14 cents for potash, we have 18 cents as the lowest valuation to be put on a bushel of ashes, irrespective of the lime, magnesia, iron and other constituents which are present in it. You can easily see how these eastern and southern fruit growers are getting an article worth to them 25 or 30 cents a bushel compared with other fertilisers. A bushel of ashes is worth to you from 20 to 25 cents, and if you can purchase them at 10 cents, they are the most economical fertiliser you can obtain for your orchards. Now, in what respect are our ashes deficient? The only constituent in which they are deficient is nitrogen, and your fruits do not require much of that, unless, perhaps, plums, which are richer than other fruits in nitrogen. If you want a mixture which would be almost absolutely perfect, I would advise, for an acre of grcund, 40 bushels of ashes, to which I would add about 100 pounds of crushed bones and about 100 pounds of sulphate of ammonia. This will give you a complete mixture, which will foot up to about $8.50, and which, put on your land every two or three years, will give you a magnificent return. How will that compare with a general mixture put on the market by the dealers in fertilisers, which would meet the same requirement? Such a mixture would cost you about $12.50. If you have not the bones, the ashes mixed with ammonia will do. With regard to leached ashes, in the process of leaching nothing is removed but the potash, and even of that from 1 to 2 per cent. is left. Perhaps you are acquainted with some experiments which were carried on a few years ago by the eastern experimental stations in connection with the yellows in peaches. It has been proven that such destructive pests more readily attack fruit trees which are deficient in mineral matter, and the different phosphates, salts of lime and phosphoric acid, enable the trees to make a more vigorous growth and withstand those attacks. It is the same principle which is observable in the case of man: disease will strike the man who has the least vitality. It has been invariably found that trees, affected with these diseases, are deficient in potash more than anything else, and by adding potash to the soil you enable the trees to resist such attacks. If you can buy ashes at 10 cents a bushel, I would strongly advise you to buy all you can. I feel so strongly on this question that I wish the Dominion Government would put such a large export duty on ashes as to make it impossible to export them at all. The export of wood ashes shows perhaps the greatest loss, so far as fertilisers are concerned, that the farmers of the country are experiencing at the present time. We are simply enriching the eastern and southern fruit growers at the expense of the farmers of this country.

II. QUANTITIES OF FERTILISING CONSTITUENTS REMOVED BY THE FRUITS ALONE.

III. QUANTITIES WITHDRAWN BY VARIOUS FRUIT CROPS PER 100 LBS. AND PER CROP

Mr. F. G. H. PATTISON (Grimsby).-What value would you attach to soft-wood ashes? In our neighborhood we can obtain the ashes of such woods as white oak, red oak, elm and ash, in considerable quantities at cheap rates. What value would you attach to these per bushel? Also, what value would you attach to the application of superphosphates and nitrate of soda, and what quantities would you recommend for appli

cation.

Prof. JAMES.-There is a mistaken idea in the minds of many people that soft-wood ashes are not so valuable as hard-wood. The difference between them is not so much in the value as in the quantity produced. Analysis shows that soft-wood ashes are worth nearly as much as hard-wood; they are worth at least four-fifths as much. Nitrate of soda contains a little less nitrogen than sulphate of ammonia, but it could be used to replace sulphate of ammonia very well. About a hundred pounds of either to the acre should be used.

Mr. ORR.-How often should the orchard have a dressing?

Prof. JAMES.-The best plan is to dress often and in smaller quantities. If you put on an application of say 30 bushels of ashes to 75 or 100 lbs. of sulphate of ammonia or nitrate of soda, I would put it on pretty often. It is so soluble that if your orchard is well drained you are in danger of losing it. I would put it on every year if possible, but at any rate every other year. The mixture I recommend will give the best return in the case of open soils rather than in heavier soils. Superphosphates alone are not likely to give as good a return as a mixture of them with potash. Potash is the first thing demanded. The bones supply the phosphoric acid, though superphosphates will of course supply it also. Superphosphates are of greater value for cereal crops than for fruits, because phosphoric acid is required principally in the formation of seed, and in grain crops the seed is everything, whereas in fruits it is a small proportion.

Mr. MORRIS.-I have been very much interested in Prof. James' address on the value of ashes, being myself a great believer in them as a food for the growth of wood. In fact I do not believe anyone else in the country has spent as much money for wood ashes as I have done in my business. We keep two or three teams constantly engaged gathering ashes, and we find them most valuable for land which is deficient in lime. A tree grown

from a mixture of barnyard manure and wood ashes-they answer better together, I think, than either one alone-will weigh perhaps twice as much as a tree grown from manure alone; it will resist diseases better, be stronger, and make in every way a very much

better tree.

President MORTON.-Is not nitrate of soda apt to leach away light soils more than sulphate of ammonia?

Prof. JAMES.-They are both liable to leach away. Perhaps it would be best to make the application in two or three doses during the year. Then it is readily taken up by the plants and is not likely to be washed away. Apply it in a dry time during the growing season. If you have your ground well mulched the loss will be still less. Mr. D. NICHOL (Cataraqui).—Would you not consider it inadvisable to apply it in the fall of the year? It has always seemed to me folly to put on a fertiliser of any kind after the ground has become frozen hard, because it is liable to be washed away before the spring comes in.

Prof. JAMES. That depends entirely on the slope of your land. If it is on a good level there is no danger of loss whatever. The safest period, of course, is the vigorous growing period of spring. Certainly if you put it on in the fall and there is much of a slope you are liable to have it washed away.

Mr. NICHOL.-Even on the level the snow is carried away by the surface drains. Prof. JAMES.-There is a great difference of opinion on that question, and I would not make a general statement one way or the other. No doubt there is a great deal of

loss in some cases, but in others I think the loss is exceedingly small.

Mr. MORRIS.-I have had some experience in this matter. I remember throwing some ashes on the land on the first of November, expecting that there would be a thaw, and I am satisfied that the whole strength of those ashes went away with the spring freshets. The whole thing went off like soap suds.

Mr. SPRINGER (Wellington).-What do you think of plowing under a green crop for fertilising?

Prof. JAMES.—The principal value of turning under a green crop is of course what you gain from the atmosphere. You are simply putting back into the soil what has been taken from it. That will not add anything in the nature of lime or phosphoric acid, but simply vegetable matter.

Mr. SPRINGER.-Will it give you nitrogen?

Prof. JAMES.-That is a much disputed point. It is believed by some that the plants take up a little nitrogen from the soil.

Mr. PATTISON.-Would you put unleached ashes on a heavy soil ?

Prof. JAMES.-On a heavy soil I would first try coal ashes. Their effect is principally mechanical or physical. They contain lime, and you are not likely to get too much lime in the land. The quantity you would add from coal ashes would not seriously affect it.

Mr. PATTISON.-Do the unmixed hardwood ashes tend to make the soil more

cohesive ?

Prof. JAMES.-No; rather the opposite.

PROPOSED LOCAL EXPERIMENT STATION.

The next question was-Would it be wise for the Department of Agriculture for Ontario to establish a local experiment station, under the charge of the Ontario Fruit Growers' Association with the especial object of testing new fruits originating in Ontario, and the keeping of living samples to aid in identification of them in connection with the proposed plant register?

Mr. A. M. SMITH.-This is not a question of my asking, but it is one in which I feel a deep interest. I think the time has arrived when something of this kind is needed. Of course we have the experimental farms at Guelph and at Ottawa, which are able to do good work in the way of testing grains and many other food products, but they are both so far out of the fruit belt that our tender varieties of fruits cannot be properly tested at either of these points, and we all know that we have to spend a good deal of our hard earned money in testing new fruits for ourselves. We often have varieties introduced to us by interested parties which turn out to be valueless. Therefore I think it is important that we should have a fruit station in southern Ontario where proper tests can be made of all tender varieties of fruits, so that in making our selections we can have something of value to rely upon. Some of us who visited the Experimental Farm at Ottawa last year were astonished to see the results of the experiments there made in the production of raspberries. I am confident that new varieties have been produced there which will supersede most of our raspberries now grown. Other countries are adopting this plan of establishing branch experimental stations where special tests can be carried on, and I do not see why we should not have something of that kind here in southern Ontario.

Mr. JAMES GOLDIE.-If this Association takes up this question I think we should agitate it until something is accomplished. If it is to be an experimental station I think it should not be confined exclusively to fruit. I would advocate testing also a few varieties of vegetables, as is done across the line.

Mr. P. C. DEMPSEY.-There is not the slightest question in my mind that an experimental station, situated somewhere on this southern peninsula, would pay the country well. It is true experimenting with new fruits is carried on to a great extent at Ottawa and Guelph, but both of these places have very severe climates, whereas the climate of this southern belt is well adapted to fruit culture. I would like to see a small experimental station for the purpose of experimenting on horticultural products established near Niagara, and I believe the Government owns land in that neighborhood, so that would cost nothing. I would like to see it include fruits, flowers and vegetables. The expense would amount to little compared with the advantages our farmers would derive from it.

The subject was, on motion, referred to the legislation committee and in addition, to a special committee consisting of Messrs. A. H. Pettit, A. M. Smith, W. E. Wellington, L. Woolverton, and such other names as the committee chose to add.